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        "content": "```\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> Sorry, I was just trying to use a name, I still don't get freenode\r\n<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: sorry about that lol\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok dansup, I have a serious question about Pixelfed for you, mind if I ask?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> (or would there be a better place?)\r\n<dansup> yes, go ahead. this is probably the best place for me to respond\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> How are you going to handle threading with Pixelfed direct?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> Mainly the following few scenarios\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> * A private reply to a Pixelfed post\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> * A private reply to a post in a public thread\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> * Multiple private replies to the same private message\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> * Users being added and removed from the DM thread\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> (that's all of them)\r\n<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: first off take a look at https://mastodon.social/@dansup/102142943395969421\r\n<dansup> DMs are treated as a one-to-one conversation\r\n<dansup> mentions are just mentions, not DM recipients\r\n<dansup> if a remote user dms a comment/reply it will appear in the DMs with a header that references the post\r\n<dansup> Keep in mind, you cannot send a DM as a reply to a post\r\n<dansup> not in pixelfed anyways\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> Yes, but you have to account for incoming behavior too\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> if it was just pixelfed2pixelfed I would imagine this being much easier\r\n<dansup> yeah, thats why all direct messages will appear in your pixelfed inbox\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok\r\n<dansup> I already tested photo attachments in Direct, and they look a lot like iMessage\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> so if @alice@social.example send @bob@pixelfed.example a message, and @bob@pixelfed.example responds, will that response be threaded?\r\n<dansup> yes\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> and if @alice@social.example sends @bob@pixelfed.example two DM's that are separate conversations, they'll appear separately?\r\n<dansup> the way is threaded can differ based on user preference, by default it will be by actor but user can choose by conversatio\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> that makes sense\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> (the reason I ask is because I'm planning to make something like Pixelfed Direct but *only* for chat)\r\n<dansup> pixelfed stores DMs differently than pleroma\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> (and that probably reveals who I really am but idk)\r\n<dansup> i still have no idea who you are, but if you feel that you have to keep that secret I respect taht\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> hah, Kaniini has a problem with me\r\n<dansup> gargron ?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> you probably don't though\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> no lol\r\n<dansup> dashequals?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> you got it\r\n<dansup> kaniini: wtf\r\n<kaniini> lol\r\n<dansup> why\r\n<kaniini> idk\r\n<kaniini> why not\r\n<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: im really torn, i never knew you were a nazi\r\n<kaniini> lul\r\n<kaniini> he's not\r\n<kaniini> he's just a stupid impressionable kid\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> aww thanks\r\n<dansup> like m fore skin\r\n<dansup> bunch of crazy americans\r\n<dansup> m4sk1n btw\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> what about him?\r\n<dansup> he is an impressionable kid too\r\n<kaniini> m4sk1n is polish\r\n<dansup> and gab took advantage of him\r\n<kaniini> what are you talking about\r\n<kaniini> are you high ?\r\n<dansup> are you?\r\n<kaniini> he set up gab social to see if the release was actually AGPL compliant\r\n<kaniini> m4sk1n contributes to mastodon lol\r\n<dansup> bruh, you know how are0h and ginny did me after I tried to be neutral\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> oh god\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> don't try to reason with them\r\n<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: why do you think i blocked you?\r\n<dansup> i dont need that drama\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> you blocked me?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> dansup I get that, but like, if you let your interactions be dictated by others, you'll be much less happy and satisfied in the long run\r\n<dansup> i know what the alt-right is, and I cant afford to take that label\r\n<kaniini> if you let people become unpersoned by wannabe leftists\r\n<kaniini> you are giving the bullies power\r\n<kaniini> it's just the same outcome as giving gab power\r\n<kaniini> just a different group of toxic assholes\r\n<dansup> kaniini: I would never in a million years think you would say that\r\n<dansup> what the fuck is going on, trwnh pls\r\n<kaniini> i say what i say because i come from a position of integrity\r\n<kaniini> something i keep observing is lacking amongst mastodon leftists\r\n<kaniini> AlexaPlayDespaci: and no i don't have anything against you, i just think you involve yourself in things that you shouldn't\r\n<kaniini> think before doing\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I can see that, I definitely do that sometimes\r\n<kaniini> don't be a reactionary\r\n<kaniini> don't archive teenagers' shit without consent\r\n<kaniini> its simple\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I talked with other members of archiveteam about that, seems like we're in agreement\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> (I mean, I was banned as a PR stunt, but people other than jason talked to me)\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> oh speaking of that, let me do a Mastodon liberal imitation, see how good this is\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> \"Don't create a searchable index of gay teens' posts!\" - send from Tootdon\r\n<dansup> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCYbZZTEwiM\r\n<kaniini> jason should not have banned you for that\r\n<kaniini> that was stupid\r\n<kaniini> but jason is frankly stupid too\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I agree\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> like\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I wasn't the one who did the archiving\r\n<kaniini> jason is the reason archive team has this mentality\r\n<kaniini> jason is the reason *you* had that mentality\r\n<kaniini> jason threw you under the bus because he knew people were ready to call him on that\r\n<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: how old are you?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> dansup 15 lol\r\n<dansup> is kaniini grooming you?\r\n<dansup> damn\r\n<kaniini> dansup: sorry i'm only interested in adults, i'm not DetectiveHyde\r\n<dansup> kaniini: what the fuck\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> you're not ProJared\r\n<kaniini> what do you mean what the fuck\r\n<dansup> wait what, DetectiveHyde follows me\r\n<kaniini> sorry he is some other person now\r\n<kaniini> druid@yoshiro.space or wtfever\r\n<kaniini> anyway he's a fucking paedo\r\n<kaniini> and it's funny\r\n<dansup> ok this got dark, I was trying to make ajoke because you said dash was young\r\n<kaniini> all of the people i know who i interact with on the regular\r\n<kaniini> who also interact with him\r\n<kaniini> 1 by 1\r\n<kaniini> they figured out\r\n<kaniini> i wasn't kidding when i said he was a paedo\r\n<kaniini> and i'm 110% serious btw\r\n<kaniini> when pleroma.site allowed under-18s\r\n<dansup> this is fucked\r\n<kaniini> he DMed two of them\r\n<kaniini> asking for nudes\r\n<kaniini> after chatting them up for a bit\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> you guys don't allow under 18's?\r\n<kaniini> generally speaking no\r\n<dansup> kaniini: thats fucked, i know your not a goof. That was a bad joke, my bad\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> might want to make that clear in your ToS\r\n<kaniini> yeah\r\n<kaniini> it's on the TODO list\r\n<kaniini> anyway\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok serious question\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> does schestowitz read the articles that he posts?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> because he posts at the rate of 1/minute it seems\r\n<kaniini> yes\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> impressive\r\n<kaniini> grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr\r\n<kaniini> i hate using other people's demotools\r\n<kaniini> the experience is always awful\r\n<kaniini> it's just funny to me\r\n<kaniini> people were all like\r\n<kaniini> why do you have a shoot on sight policy for hyde\r\n<kaniini> that's not fair\r\n<kaniini> and now\r\n<kaniini> they are all like\r\n<kaniini> oh\r\n<kaniini> ok\r\n<kaniini> we get it now\r\n<kaniini> lol\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> btw I need advice\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> other IRC channels I should join?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> also, this guy's the pedo, right? https://yorishiro.space/objects/63123788-07f5-4a11-82b2-5f0657ebfe7e\r\n<kaniini> yes\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I think I can see that now\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> why did you censor the word heck?\r\n<dansup> trwnh recommended I say h*ck instead of fuck\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> makes sense, I guess you gotta be relateable to the teens your software targets\r\n<trwnh> pizza-fire-donald-glover-community.gif\r\n<trwnh> what happened here\r\n<trwnh> anyway it really shouldn't be so contentious to say \"hey here's an example of how to use the COSTAR env variables, shipping by default\" and use gab as the reject_domain rule\r\n<trwnh> it should go without saying that decisions should be made bc it's the right thing to do, not to score \"points\" \r\n<trwnh> also i will say that it is genuinely scary to have people show up outside your house, even if they don't do anything. so i disagree with the characterization\r\n<trwnh> ok i think i'm caught up lmao\r\n<dansup> pizza-fire-donald-glover-community.gif lmao\r\n<dansup> \"you are the reason gab exists\" ... pixelfed is only a year old lmao\r\n<trwnh> who even\r\n<dansup> oh this is great, they quoted a tweet that attributed pixelfeds toot to mastodon.social lmao\r\n<dansup> https://twitter.com/getongab/status/1147118304248549376\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> LMAO that's too many layers of screwed up\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> also\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I love that the saying \"an absolute ealgase\" now exists, apparently\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I'm kinda tempted to leave the Fediverse\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I thought it would be a better alternative, but it seems like the same type of people still exist here\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> just, too exhausting\r\n<trwnh> lmfao\r\n<trwnh> it'd help at least to learn not to double down on a convo when it isn't going well. a little humility and introspection goes a long way\r\n<trwnh> the ideal or principle of a thing is usually nowhere near as important as the social context of the people you are interacting with. if you find yourself adamantly defending something, first stop to consider whether it's worth it. or whether you have a useful contribution to make to the topic that hasn't been said by anyone else.  and be willing to recognize that you can be wrong, you don't know everything, so be charitable and try to understand where people are coming from\r\n<dansup> you know, the nice thing about gab joining was people showing their true colors\r\n<dansup> people who I thought were decent, and cool end up being alt-right idiots\r\n<dansup> cut ties with fedilab and angristan\r\n<dansup> lains gunna come back to a way different fedi\r\n<kaniini> lol\r\n<kaniini> why do you care about alt-right\r\n<kaniini> you're canadian\r\n<kaniini> alt-right in canada is like\r\n<kaniini> we don't eat at tim horton's\r\n<dansup> nah, we have proud boys here too\r\n<dansup> one of my roommates loves trump over our own PM\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> angristan is alt-right?\r\n<kaniini> well\r\n<kaniini> in fairness\r\n<kaniini> Trudeau is a fuckboi\r\n<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: he acts neutral and embraces free speech but is french\r\n<dansup> kaniini: never talk about my justin like that\r\n<dansup> have you seen his hair\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok so\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I really don't wanna get into a debate here too\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> but free speech != alt right\r\n<kaniini> i'm alt-left haven't you seen my juche.town profile\r\n<kaniini> i'm just patiently waiting for gab to discover this instance\r\n<kaniini> i feel like torba may have murdered gab with his incompetence though\r\n<kaniini> so i fear we may never get to that chapter in the roleplaying campaign\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I wonder if Gab likes Despacito...\r\n<kaniini> i know i hate it\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> well\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> it doesn't violate the rules\r\n<dansup> ive never heard that song before\r\n<dansup> dunno who that alexa is either\r\n<kaniini> don't make me call for a meeting of the 1st Committee on the Matter of the Juche Idea to ban Despacito\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> this instance is actually so funny though\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I can imagine the boomers' reactions\r\n<dansup> i still dont know if I picked the right logo https://github.com/pixelfed/pixelfed/issues/295#issuecomment-398545910\r\n<dansup> the others look so much better, ugh\r\n<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: ofc you would post this https://twitter.com/elalgase/status/1147255487081132034\r\n<dansup> also why did you say the N word to PV\r\n<dansup> even im not that stupid\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> well\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I'm no longer that stupid\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> my real mistake was not domain-muting them\r\n<dansup> oh damn, pixelfed.social/admin has like 26 new followers\r\n<dansup> since I closed mstdn.io/@pixelfed\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> nice\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> still don't see the problem with mstdn.io but whatevver\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> s/whatevver/whatever/\r\n<dansup> the admin does not care about moderation\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> like\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> there are Nazis on mstdn.io?\r\n<dansup> personally I dont care, but when pixelfed.social official account is there, I do care\r\n<dansup> reply-guys galore\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I still don't really understand what a reply-guy is\r\n<dansup> https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=reply%20guy\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> doesn't really seem like a moderation issue to me, I'd just mute 'em\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> but ok, I thought it was over Gab, that's more reasonable\r\n<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: This goes back to a year ago, when PeerTube dev asked \"why would you ever want to block anyone\"\r\n<dansup> and it changed my whole perspective\r\n<kaniini> to be fair\r\n<dansup> Started doing research and found out Instagram is the most toxic social media platform\r\n<dansup> adults who grew up with the internet before social media is one thing, cyber bullying and shit kids/teenagers have to put up with now is down right scary\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I think I'll probably switch to Pleroma\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> the problem is anti-harassment concern trolling influences development\r\n<kaniini> AlexaPlayDespaci: i think it is important to consider how to mitigate harassment when designing software in this space\r\n<trwnh> tangentially, i feel like ceding control over what shows up on your own profile was one of the single biggest mistakes in social media\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> what do you mean?\r\n<trwnh> and by ceding control over your profile i mean that you should be able to control what you publish on your own resources\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> trwnh: it's an unconventional design choice but I'm a fan of exposing everything to the user\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> uh\r\n<trwnh> in twitter when someone replies to you, that's it. their tweet is forever attached to yours, even if you block them\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah I see what you mean\r\n<trwnh> and other people still see it\r\n<trwnh> so that opens the door for reply-spam\r\n<trwnh> which is part of why twitter became a shithole (there are many reasons but this is the earliest one)\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> well in that case\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> the Fediverse will only be worse\r\n<trwnh> why do people devote their time to being assholes in replies to famous people? because they know it'll get visibility\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> because there's no concept of a thread owner, it's reversed\r\n<trwnh> AlexaPlayDespaci: there's no thread owner on twitter either\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> true but I don't think you can untag people there\r\n<trwnh> you can untag but it's not encouraged at all. masto web frontend auto-highlights all secondary mentions so that typing will overwrite them. twitter you have to click through some weird dialogs and uncheck all the people you wanna remove\r\n<trwnh> anyway the main thing i'm talking about is that really, the fact that some resource exists somewhere does *not* require you or your software to advertise its existence\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah that makes sense\r\n<trwnh> as i said to dansup when discussing the \"disable comments\" thing -- yes, people can *technically* create an inreplyto\r\n<trwnh> but why should you be forced to have it visible on your side?\r\n<trwnh> your software is creating the replies collection\r\n<trwnh> so it should get to decide whether it gets published in full, in part, or at all\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> proper activitypub c2s would fix that\r\n<trwnh> it's doable with just s2s\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> but Mastodon wouldn't even work with c2s due to it not making a replies collection\r\n<trwnh> when you have your AS2 document just don't add whichever property you don't want to be available\r\n<trwnh> and when generating your HTML / frontend, don't include their representations\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> that makes sense\r\n<trwnh> there you go, \"disabled\" comments (really hidden / delisted, if you wanna nitpick)\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok so\r\n<trwnh> to the user, the distinction may not necessarily matter -- in the same way that technically anyone is free to reply to your post on their own website\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> alice@pixelfed.example makes pixelfed.example/p/1 with disabled comments\r\n<trwnh> i could reply to an instagram post by hosting a static html document on my webiste\r\n<trwnh> *website\r\n<trwnh> and that doesn't even require me to have an instagram account\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> bob@evil.example makes a comment with an inReplyTo of https://pixelfed.example/p/1\r\n<trwnh> in essence: my resource links to your resource and declares it is inreplyto\r\n<trwnh> your resource does not have to do the same\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> cindy@chatty.example follows bob but not alice (and is the only user of chatty.example, so they didn't see alice's post)\r\n<trwnh> mute/block doesn't even factor in here, because you can't \"block\" someone IRL\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> what happens when they get bob's post?  what should chatty.example do with it?\r\n<trwnh> presumably cindy's software can resolve the thread, if alice's post is otherwise public\r\n<trwnh> so cindy would be able to see bob reply to alice\r\n<trwnh> if you visit alice's site, you see no replies\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> which kinda defeats the purpose, doesn't it?\r\n<trwnh> if you ask alice's site for the AS2 object, there will not be any \"replies\"\r\n<trwnh> as far as alice is concerned (and for people visiting alice's site), this is all that is needed\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok, I guess\r\n<trwnh> having some technical way to prevent bob from making a reply is nice, but not needed. bob is free to publish whatever they want\r\n<trwnh> in whatever format\r\n<trwnh> what would be *really* nice is if cindy's software was aware that alice's software had disabled replies\r\n<trwnh> then cindy's software can discard bob's reply as invalid\r\n<trwnh> really the technical solution here is OCAPs as you've probably heard about -- you can't reply to alice's post if you don't know how to refer to it\r\n<dansup> oh well, enough gab talk lets federate some pixels\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> oh boy\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> everyone here knows Ginny, right?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I just reported her for violating the CoC she wanted implemented in Funkwhale, because she definitely violated it\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I wonder what will happen...\r\n<dansup> i tried to warn you\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I didn't even do anything after the warning\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> she decided to go after relatively old toots\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> anyway, hopefully she gets some karma\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> because she blatantly violated it\r\n<trwnh> AlexaPlayDespaci: why would you care about going after someone so much? give it a rest\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> because she personally attacked and insulted me?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> otherwise I wouldn't care\r\n<trwnh> if that's true then block her and move on\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I did\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> she doesn't care\r\n<trwnh> idk why people like to draw out conflicts\r\n<dansup> preach\r\n<kaniini> https://mastodon.eliotberriot.com/users/eliotberriot/statuses/102421055009209266\r\n<kaniini> wew\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> holy wow\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> that's just\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> filled with lies\r\n<kaniini> idk\r\n<kaniini> the blog post seems pretty on point\r\n<kaniini> i mean, you're 15, or so you say, but you do have a history of manipulative antisocial behaviour\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> well\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> most of what he said is just wrong\r\n<kaniini> how is it wrong?  his blog post cites examples of your behaviour\r\n<kaniini> your behaviour isn't great\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> because it lies about what I did\r\n<kaniini> if you were an adult, i would not be giving you the opportunity to redeem yourself\r\n<kaniini> no it doesn't\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> > DashEquals was the person who archived the now down Berries.Space Mastodon instance\r\n<kaniini> you did take ownership of it\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> nope, I supported it.\r\n<dansup> did you delete your dashequals account?\r\n<kaniini> you came out speaking in an authoritative tone justifying the actions of archive team\r\n<kaniini> which means *you took ownership of it*\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> yep\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I deleted it\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> kaniini not worth debating\r\n<kaniini> it is worth discussing if you want to get to the root of why people hate your behaviour\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok, I'll accept that I did, unfortunately, come across as representing AT's actions\r\n<dansup> lmao\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> still, the fact that I've clarified multiple times that I did not do the archiving and yet the myth persisted\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> c'mon\r\n<trwnh> AlexaPlayDespaci: highly recommend you take that blog post to heart\r\n<kaniini> i would also highly recommend you stop going by dashequals lmfao\r\n<trwnh> the only thing that's wrong is the bit about you doing the archiving\r\n<kaniini> needless to say you've burned that identity\r\n<kaniini> like\r\n<kaniini> i just want to be blunt for a moment\r\n<trwnh> no point in changing names if the behavior stays the same\r\n<kaniini> you managed to basically get all of the key fediverse technical folks annoyed with you\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah\r\n<kaniini> think about this\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I'm done with that identity\r\n<kaniini> we have basic consensus that you are ANNOYING\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> and I have taken the blog post to heart\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I did make mistakes\r\n<trwnh> that's a lot of mistakes\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I am going to respond to it though, because while parts were true, parts were definitely not\r\n<kaniini> this is a group that cannot agree on anything\r\n<kaniini> and if you doubt this\r\n<kaniini> look at how fucking bad the AP spec is\r\n<kaniini> just to satisfy everyone\r\n<trwnh> if you're serious about improving, uh, i'd advise you to publish an apology instead\r\n<trwnh> \"what i did was unequivocally wrong, i'm sorry for it, and going forward i do not plan to continue my behavior\r\n<trwnh> and then actually follow through on it\r\n<trwnh> at this point simply saying \"i didn't archive berries\" is a nitpick\r\n<trwnh> also, learning when to shut up and let things go is a crucial life skill\r\n<dansup> amen\r\n<dansup> veb and lukevers used to prevent me from saying stupid shit, but now they have familys\r\n<dansup> now trwnh and kaniini are like varys and tyrion\r\n<kaniini> yes also\r\n<trwnh> whomst're they\r\n<kaniini> who the fuck\r\n<kaniini> cares about ginny\r\n<dansup> a good queen is only as good as her advisors\r\n<kaniini> god\r\n<dansup> I've known luke for almost 10 years now, we go back to the meshnet days\r\n<dansup> veb is some dude I met on irc the other night\r\n<kaniini> people should stop getting baited by ginny\r\n<trwnh> people should stop sending shit her way\r\n<kaniini> exactly\r\n<trwnh> she legit gets a lot of harassment\r\n<kaniini> trwnh: she does, but she baits a lot of it too\r\n<kaniini> it is typical borderline personality disorder behaviour\r\n<dansup> this channel should not be so negative, there is a lot of positive things going on right now like pixelfed bringing hashtag follows\r\n<trwnh> calling it \"bait\" is like victim blaming to me, i don't particularly blame people who are so scarred\r\n<kaniini> bait is maybe wrong word\r\n<kaniini> what i am saying is\r\n<kaniini> she is borderline\r\n<trwnh> it's maybe a bit inflammatory and aggressive (bc it is, rightfully so)\r\n<kaniini> the solution is to ignore those people\r\n<kaniini> and not feed into whatever they are doing\r\n<kaniini> then\r\n<kaniini> 1) you are not part of their problem\r\n<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci did try to creep into her matrix dms, who tf does that lmao\r\n<kaniini> 2) they are not annoying you with their borderline\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I was trying to ask her to stop harassing me\r\n<kaniini> bruh\r\n<trwnh> dude...\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> as you're supposed to do according to the CoC\r\n<kaniini> sometimes you just have to recognize\r\n<kaniini> that some people have issues\r\n<kaniini> and be the bigger person\r\n<kaniini> and leave it be\r\n<dansup> her personal account is not a part of the CoC, she is just contracted, not a dev\r\n<kaniini> that too\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> she represents the project\r\n<trwnh> you can't really maintain a history of unwanted engagement then say you're the one who wants the harassment to stop\r\n<kaniini> like fuck, just leave her alone\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> the CoC applies\r\n<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: the sooner you realize that you shouldn't care what other people say about you online, the better\r\n<kaniini> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^\r\n<trwnh> what you shouldve done is, idk, not try to message someone?\r\n<kaniini> also ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^\r\n<dansup> \"focused on the inner me, never on the enemy\" - jesus\r\n<dansup> and big sean\r\n<trwnh> wrt people like ginny, like, i get where they're coming from\r\n<dansup> alexa play marvins room by drake\r\n<kaniini> trwnh: ginny is complicated\r\n<kaniini> trwnh: she does have some good points\r\n<trwnh> i know what it's like to be in her position but only a fraction of it\r\n<trwnh> i quit using twitter bc nazis would flood my mentions\r\n<kaniini> trwnh: i used to be friends with her and broke off the friendship because i couldn't deal with it\r\n<dansup> nobody ever mentions me on twitter besides my homies like luke smh\r\n<kaniini> like\r\n<kaniini> i don't have anything against ginny\r\n<dansup> the only political thing I said on twitter was \"stamina\" after watching the hillary vs trump debates in sept\r\n<trwnh> dansup: man, saying anything political on twitter in 2016 forward is a goddamn minefield\r\n<trwnh> people namesearch and look for people to actively harass\r\n<trwnh> you say the wrong word and a mob descends on you\r\n<dansup> yeah I never used twitter that much, only used it to follow Skream and Benga on Radio 1 back in 2013/2014\r\n<trwnh> a while back drexel university fired a professor for mocking white genocide as a nonsense conspiracy theory, i said i was considering going to drexel for a masters but decided against it\r\n<trwnh> my mentions for the next 2-3 days were terrible\r\n<dansup> when you actually take a step back and look at the political env compared to 20 years ago, its sad how backwards it is.\r\n<trwnh> all kinds of slurs hurled at me, people posting sieg heil gifs, death threats, etc\r\n<trwnh> i can't imagine living like that 24/7\r\n<trwnh> and that's just one incident, i've had others\r\n<dansup> thats insane, I couldn't imagine that back then\r\n<dansup> now things here in Alberta. Canada are a lot like the USA\r\n<dansup> if you believe in climate change, you are a \"liberal cuck\" and against our oil industry\r\n<dansup> they make fun of our PM in all the local fb groups\r\n<dansup> and somehow they think trump is better, even tho trump enacted tarrifs against us\r\n<trwnh> seeing stuff like this makes me feel terrible (cw: all kinds of shit, the worst of humanity) https://ginnymcqueen.com/abuse/\r\n<dansup> enough ginny talk, this is not a ginny-hate channel\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> you're in alberta!\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I knew you were in canada, but I guess I just thought you were in ontario\r\n<dansup> nah, alberta. its the texas of canada\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> lol\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> sounds like a cool place\r\n<dansup> trwnh: I agree\r\n<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: its not bad, I'm aboriginal and our lands go back thousands of years\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> oh really?  that's awesome!\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> does canada treat aboriginals well?  The US shamefully does not\r\n<dansup> well my family emigrated from the USA over 100 years ago, I would have been a chief\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> what tribe/region?\r\n<dansup> it passes down from the eldest son to the eldest son\r\n<dansup> I'd have to ask my dad, I dont know off the top of my head. A few years ago we found this out, and my grandpa changed his name to what it used to be\r\n<dansup> this is me at a family reunion https://pixelfed.social/p/dansup/34473\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah cool!\r\n<dansup> all my cousin are bi-racial, you probably couldn't tell my brothers and I are related\r\n<dansup> trwnh: collections are pretty much ready\r\n<trwnh> cool\r\n<dansup> I need to test in dark mode\r\n<trwnh> imo dark mode should be marked as temp-deprecated\r\n<trwnh> it's too incomplete and we keep adding new features\r\n<trwnh> we should use css variables for our palette\r\n<dansup> we do\r\n<dansup> but yeah i agree\r\n<dansup> kaniini: why did you mention me lol\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I think at this point\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I'll try to just not care about what others say\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> shouldn't bother me\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> anyway, thanks for putting up with me\r\n<dansup> np\r\n<trwnh> AlexaPlayDespaci: if you havent seen it already https://emsenn.net/essays/there-and-back-again-a-fediverse-journey/\r\n<kaniini> this is one of the few platforms\r\n<kaniini> where you can learn from your mistakes and reboot\r\n<kaniini> i suggest you do both of these things\r\n<trwnh> that's the last i wanna say about the whole thing bc frankly i'm tired of the convo lol\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> trwnh thanks\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I don't think I have many other accounts\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> at least not under a linkable name\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> anyway\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> all I want at this point is foregiveness\r\n<dansup> you need to earn that\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> like, I've said and done some stupid shit, I'll admit\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> but like, people are still talking about the archiving thing, and that was a while ago\r\n<dansup> the damage you've done to certain playvicious.social users will probably never be repaired, but you can take this moment as wisdom for the future. Once you turn 18/21 you're an adult and your reputation is everything.\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I've done damage to PV users?\r\n<dansup> well from what I've seen you've said some pretty inappropriate things regarding slavery and the n-word. I am not white and I can see where they are coming from, these people are twice or 3 times your age and have a lot of life experience.\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I see maybe about the n-word\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> but about slavery?\r\n<dansup> What the fuck do you actually know about slavery that they can't google themselves?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> Nothing\r\n<dansup> the fact you even bring it up is not a good sign\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> which is why when they posted some BS, I countered it\r\n<dansup> what state do you live in\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> why?\r\n<dansup> is it a red or blue state\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> blue\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> but on the edge\r\n<dansup> are your parents blue or red voters?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> blue\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> the county I'm in is very liberal\r\n<dansup> dont lie to me son\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I'm not\r\n<dansup> i dont care, im just asking in the context of this conversation\r\n<dansup> if they are democratic, and you live in a democratic state, why do people think you are alt-right/nazi\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> uh IRL, they don't really\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> people who actually know me don't think I'm alt-right\r\n<dansup> you play any sports?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> nope\r\n<dansup> you should consider one, great learning experience\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I used to do field hockey\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> and before that, wrestling\r\n<dansup> baseball/hockey runs in my blood, and I grew up watching my dad play.\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah cool\r\n<dansup> played em in HS and that is what saved me from bad grades\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> both my dad and granddad on his side were wrestlers (not super competitive, just for fun)\r\n<dansup> consider getting into that, you'll make a lot of friends and chicks love that shit\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I wish I could\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I just don't enjoy them, no matter how hard I try\r\n<dansup> you need to find a good coach, maybe your dad\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah, I guess\r\n<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: do it broski, get that scholarship &#128175;\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I really don't think I'd be that good\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> you know in gym class how they say \"if you do your best you'll get a good grade\"?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I did my best and I got a terrible grade\r\n<dansup> thats not an excuse, you need to want to succeed. You can't accept failure without trying your best\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok true\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> sports just like\r\n<dansup> I know you can do it, at least give it a try. I wish I didn't throw away my education, you need to keep all options available\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> really are not my thing\r\n<dansup> Did you ever play them much as a kid?\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> well yeah\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I quit around age 10\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I am gonna go for more education though\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I like the idea of a merit-based scholarship that's only based on SAT scores\r\n<dansup> yeah do what you want. I can't believe I just said that shit, thats basically what my dad said to me. Sorry a bit drunk\r\n<dansup> im just waiting for webpack to finish compiling\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah, I should probably listen to you, I'm not that smart about life anyways (more of a computers guy)\r\n<trwnh> being blue in a blue state doesn't really have much bearing on not being lowkey racist, i've found. it's just deep in the culture of america at this point, for a lot of people it's not even intentional, they're just ignorant and out of their element\r\n<trwnh> but if i had a dime for every time someone was in my mentions with that kinda ignorance i'd be rich\r\n<trwnh> it takes active work and effort at being better and improving\r\n<dansup> ^\r\n<kaniini> trwnh: which ignorance\r\n<kaniini> im too lazy to read the log\r\n<trwnh> just microaggressions basically\r\n<trwnh> democrats usually take their being marginally better than republicans as something they should be congratulated over\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I mean, I'm not a huge dem fan either\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> but I don't see the microaggressions there\r\n<trwnh> well yeah the point of microaggressions is that they're these little things that marginalized people just end up living with, except they add up over time\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah, I guess it's hard to notice if you're not marginalized\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> what was one of the ones that I used?  I would like to avoid using them.\r\n<trwnh> \"oh you're so eloquent\" said to a black person is a microaggression bc, while on the surface it doesn't seem like a bad thing to say, it subtly calls back to the stereotype that black people are uneducated and AAVE is just bad grammar\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I know what microaggressions are, I was asking for an example since you said that the conversation had them\r\n<trwnh> or \"your english is very good\" to people who aren't 1st-gen immigrants\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> (or maybe I misunderstood you)\r\n<trwnh> stuff like that tends to add up\r\n<trwnh> \"you're one of the good ones!\"\r\n<trwnh> or like, terrorist jokes\r\n<trwnh> or being expected to denounce every single instance of violence in the middle east\r\n<trwnh> from personal experience\r\n<trwnh> there's the open racism of the right, then there's the subtle racism of the center-right\r\n<trwnh> (bc let's be real, the US does not have a real left wing)\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> that's true\r\n<AlexaPlayDespaci> I'm gonna go to bed, you gave me some stuff to think about though\r\n```",
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hi there

Rubin Macansh

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https://distbin.com/activities/55b7287e-ee10-45c9-9f66-5a882957417a

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<AlexaPlayDespaci> Sorry, I was just trying to use a name, I still don't get freenode
<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: sorry about that lol
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok dansup, I have a serious question about Pixelfed for you, mind if I ask?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> (or would there be a better place?)
<dansup> yes, go ahead. this is probably the best place for me to respond
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok
<AlexaPlayDespaci> How are you going to handle threading with Pixelfed direct?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> Mainly the following few scenarios
<AlexaPlayDespaci> * A private reply to a Pixelfed post
<AlexaPlayDespaci> * A private reply to a post in a public thread
<AlexaPlayDespaci> * Multiple private replies to the same private message
<AlexaPlayDespaci> * Users being added and removed from the DM thread
<AlexaPlayDespaci> (that's all of them)
<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: first off take a look at https://mastodon.social/@dansup/102142943395969421
<dansup> DMs are treated as a one-to-one conversation
<dansup> mentions are just mentions, not DM recipients
<dansup> if a remote user dms a comment/reply it will appear in the DMs with a header that references the post
<dansup> Keep in mind, you cannot send a DM as a reply to a post
<dansup> not in pixelfed anyways
<AlexaPlayDespaci> Yes, but you have to account for incoming behavior too
<AlexaPlayDespaci> if it was just pixelfed2pixelfed I would imagine this being much easier
<dansup> yeah, thats why all direct messages will appear in your pixelfed inbox
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok
<dansup> I already tested photo attachments in Direct, and they look a lot like iMessage
<AlexaPlayDespaci> so if @alice@social.example send @bob@pixelfed.example a message, and @bob@pixelfed.example responds, will that response be threaded?
<dansup> yes
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok
<AlexaPlayDespaci> and if @alice@social.example sends @bob@pixelfed.example two DM's that are separate conversations, they'll appear separately?
<dansup> the way is threaded can differ based on user preference, by default it will be by actor but user can choose by conversatio
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah
<AlexaPlayDespaci> that makes sense
<AlexaPlayDespaci> (the reason I ask is because I'm planning to make something like Pixelfed Direct but *only* for chat)
<dansup> pixelfed stores DMs differently than pleroma
<AlexaPlayDespaci> (and that probably reveals who I really am but idk)
<dansup> i still have no idea who you are, but if you feel that you have to keep that secret I respect taht
<AlexaPlayDespaci> hah, Kaniini has a problem with me
<dansup> gargron ?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> you probably don't though
<AlexaPlayDespaci> no lol
<dansup> dashequals?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> you got it
<dansup> kaniini: wtf
<kaniini> lol
<dansup> why
<kaniini> idk
<kaniini> why not
<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: im really torn, i never knew you were a nazi
<kaniini> lul
<kaniini> he's not
<kaniini> he's just a stupid impressionable kid
<AlexaPlayDespaci> aww thanks
<dansup> like m fore skin
<dansup> bunch of crazy americans
<dansup> m4sk1n btw
<AlexaPlayDespaci> what about him?
<dansup> he is an impressionable kid too
<kaniini> m4sk1n is polish
<dansup> and gab took advantage of him
<kaniini> what are you talking about
<kaniini> are you high ?
<dansup> are you?
<kaniini> he set up gab social to see if the release was actually AGPL compliant
<kaniini> m4sk1n contributes to mastodon lol
<dansup> bruh, you know how are0h and ginny did me after I tried to be neutral
<AlexaPlayDespaci> oh god
<AlexaPlayDespaci> don't try to reason with them
<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: why do you think i blocked you?
<dansup> i dont need that drama
<AlexaPlayDespaci> you blocked me?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> dansup I get that, but like, if you let your interactions be dictated by others, you'll be much less happy and satisfied in the long run
<dansup> i know what the alt-right is, and I cant afford to take that label
<kaniini> if you let people become unpersoned by wannabe leftists
<kaniini> you are giving the bullies power
<kaniini> it's just the same outcome as giving gab power
<kaniini> just a different group of toxic assholes
<dansup> kaniini: I would never in a million years think you would say that
<dansup> what the fuck is going on, trwnh pls
<kaniini> i say what i say because i come from a position of integrity
<kaniini> something i keep observing is lacking amongst mastodon leftists
<kaniini> AlexaPlayDespaci: and no i don't have anything against you, i just think you involve yourself in things that you shouldn't
<kaniini> think before doing
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I can see that, I definitely do that sometimes
<kaniini> don't be a reactionary
<kaniini> don't archive teenagers' shit without consent
<kaniini> its simple
<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I talked with other members of archiveteam about that, seems like we're in agreement
<AlexaPlayDespaci> (I mean, I was banned as a PR stunt, but people other than jason talked to me)
<AlexaPlayDespaci> oh speaking of that, let me do a Mastodon liberal imitation, see how good this is
<AlexaPlayDespaci> "Don't create a searchable index of gay teens' posts!" - send from Tootdon
<dansup> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCYbZZTEwiM
<kaniini> jason should not have banned you for that
<kaniini> that was stupid
<kaniini> but jason is frankly stupid too
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I agree
<AlexaPlayDespaci> like
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I wasn't the one who did the archiving
<kaniini> jason is the reason archive team has this mentality
<kaniini> jason is the reason *you* had that mentality
<kaniini> jason threw you under the bus because he knew people were ready to call him on that
<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: how old are you?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah
<AlexaPlayDespaci> dansup 15 lol
<dansup> is kaniini grooming you?
<dansup> damn
<kaniini> dansup: sorry i'm only interested in adults, i'm not DetectiveHyde
<dansup> kaniini: what the fuck
<AlexaPlayDespaci> you're not ProJared
<kaniini> what do you mean what the fuck
<dansup> wait what, DetectiveHyde follows me
<kaniini> sorry he is some other person now
<kaniini> druid@yoshiro.space or wtfever
<kaniini> anyway he's a fucking paedo
<kaniini> and it's funny
<dansup> ok this got dark, I was trying to make ajoke because you said dash was young
<kaniini> all of the people i know who i interact with on the regular
<kaniini> who also interact with him
<kaniini> 1 by 1
<kaniini> they figured out
<kaniini> i wasn't kidding when i said he was a paedo
<kaniini> and i'm 110% serious btw
<kaniini> when pleroma.site allowed under-18s
<dansup> this is fucked
<kaniini> he DMed two of them
<kaniini> asking for nudes
<kaniini> after chatting them up for a bit
<AlexaPlayDespaci> you guys don't allow under 18's?
<kaniini> generally speaking no
<dansup> kaniini: thats fucked, i know your not a goof. That was a bad joke, my bad
<AlexaPlayDespaci> might want to make that clear in your ToS
<kaniini> yeah
<kaniini> it's on the TODO list
<kaniini> anyway
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok serious question
<AlexaPlayDespaci> does schestowitz read the articles that he posts?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> because he posts at the rate of 1/minute it seems
<kaniini> yes
<AlexaPlayDespaci> impressive
<kaniini> grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
<kaniini> i hate using other people's demotools
<kaniini> the experience is always awful
<kaniini> it's just funny to me
<kaniini> people were all like
<kaniini> why do you have a shoot on sight policy for hyde
<kaniini> that's not fair
<kaniini> and now
<kaniini> they are all like
<kaniini> oh
<kaniini> ok
<kaniini> we get it now
<kaniini> lol
<AlexaPlayDespaci> btw I need advice
<AlexaPlayDespaci> other IRC channels I should join?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> also, this guy's the pedo, right? https://yorishiro.space/objects/63123788-07f5-4a11-82b2-5f0657ebfe7e
<kaniini> yes
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I think I can see that now
<AlexaPlayDespaci> why did you censor the word heck?
<dansup> trwnh recommended I say h*ck instead of fuck
<AlexaPlayDespaci> makes sense, I guess you gotta be relateable to the teens your software targets
<trwnh> pizza-fire-donald-glover-community.gif
<trwnh> what happened here
<trwnh> anyway it really shouldn't be so contentious to say "hey here's an example of how to use the COSTAR env variables, shipping by default" and use gab as the reject_domain rule
<trwnh> it should go without saying that decisions should be made bc it's the right thing to do, not to score "points" 
<trwnh> also i will say that it is genuinely scary to have people show up outside your house, even if they don't do anything. so i disagree with the characterization
<trwnh> ok i think i'm caught up lmao
<dansup> pizza-fire-donald-glover-community.gif lmao
<dansup> "you are the reason gab exists" ... pixelfed is only a year old lmao
<trwnh> who even
<dansup> oh this is great, they quoted a tweet that attributed pixelfeds toot to mastodon.social lmao
<dansup> https://twitter.com/getongab/status/1147118304248549376
<AlexaPlayDespaci> LMAO that's too many layers of screwed up
<AlexaPlayDespaci> also
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I love that the saying "an absolute ealgase" now exists, apparently
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I'm kinda tempted to leave the Fediverse
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I thought it would be a better alternative, but it seems like the same type of people still exist here
<AlexaPlayDespaci> just, too exhausting
<trwnh> lmfao
<trwnh> it'd help at least to learn not to double down on a convo when it isn't going well. a little humility and introspection goes a long way
<trwnh> the ideal or principle of a thing is usually nowhere near as important as the social context of the people you are interacting with. if you find yourself adamantly defending something, first stop to consider whether it's worth it. or whether you have a useful contribution to make to the topic that hasn't been said by anyone else.  and be willing to recognize that you can be wrong, you don't know everything, so be charitable and try to understand where people are coming from
<dansup> you know, the nice thing about gab joining was people showing their true colors
<dansup> people who I thought were decent, and cool end up being alt-right idiots
<dansup> cut ties with fedilab and angristan
<dansup> lains gunna come back to a way different fedi
<kaniini> lol
<kaniini> why do you care about alt-right
<kaniini> you're canadian
<kaniini> alt-right in canada is like
<kaniini> we don't eat at tim horton's
<dansup> nah, we have proud boys here too
<dansup> one of my roommates loves trump over our own PM
<AlexaPlayDespaci> angristan is alt-right?
<kaniini> well
<kaniini> in fairness
<kaniini> Trudeau is a fuckboi
<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: he acts neutral and embraces free speech but is french
<dansup> kaniini: never talk about my justin like that
<dansup> have you seen his hair
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok so
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I really don't wanna get into a debate here too
<AlexaPlayDespaci> but free speech != alt right
<kaniini> i'm alt-left haven't you seen my juche.town profile
<kaniini> i'm just patiently waiting for gab to discover this instance
<kaniini> i feel like torba may have murdered gab with his incompetence though
<kaniini> so i fear we may never get to that chapter in the roleplaying campaign
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I wonder if Gab likes Despacito...
<kaniini> i know i hate it
<AlexaPlayDespaci> well
<AlexaPlayDespaci> it doesn't violate the rules
<dansup> ive never heard that song before
<dansup> dunno who that alexa is either
<kaniini> don't make me call for a meeting of the 1st Committee on the Matter of the Juche Idea to ban Despacito
<AlexaPlayDespaci> this instance is actually so funny though
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I can imagine the boomers' reactions
<dansup> i still dont know if I picked the right logo https://github.com/pixelfed/pixelfed/issues/295#issuecomment-398545910
<dansup> the others look so much better, ugh
<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: ofc you would post this https://twitter.com/elalgase/status/1147255487081132034
<dansup> also why did you say the N word to PV
<dansup> even im not that stupid
<AlexaPlayDespaci> well
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I'm no longer that stupid
<AlexaPlayDespaci> my real mistake was not domain-muting them
<dansup> oh damn, pixelfed.social/admin has like 26 new followers
<dansup> since I closed mstdn.io/@pixelfed
<AlexaPlayDespaci> nice
<AlexaPlayDespaci> still don't see the problem with mstdn.io but whatevver
<AlexaPlayDespaci> s/whatevver/whatever/
<dansup> the admin does not care about moderation
<AlexaPlayDespaci> like
<AlexaPlayDespaci> there are Nazis on mstdn.io?
<dansup> personally I dont care, but when pixelfed.social official account is there, I do care
<dansup> reply-guys galore
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I still don't really understand what a reply-guy is
<dansup> https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=reply%20guy
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah
<AlexaPlayDespaci> doesn't really seem like a moderation issue to me, I'd just mute 'em
<AlexaPlayDespaci> but ok, I thought it was over Gab, that's more reasonable
<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: This goes back to a year ago, when PeerTube dev asked "why would you ever want to block anyone"
<dansup> and it changed my whole perspective
<kaniini> to be fair
<dansup> Started doing research and found out Instagram is the most toxic social media platform
<dansup> adults who grew up with the internet before social media is one thing, cyber bullying and shit kids/teenagers have to put up with now is down right scary
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I think I'll probably switch to Pleroma
<AlexaPlayDespaci> the problem is anti-harassment concern trolling influences development
<kaniini> AlexaPlayDespaci: i think it is important to consider how to mitigate harassment when designing software in this space
<trwnh> tangentially, i feel like ceding control over what shows up on your own profile was one of the single biggest mistakes in social media
<AlexaPlayDespaci> what do you mean?
<trwnh> and by ceding control over your profile i mean that you should be able to control what you publish on your own resources
<AlexaPlayDespaci> trwnh: it's an unconventional design choice but I'm a fan of exposing everything to the user
<AlexaPlayDespaci> uh
<trwnh> in twitter when someone replies to you, that's it. their tweet is forever attached to yours, even if you block them
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah I see what you mean
<trwnh> and other people still see it
<trwnh> so that opens the door for reply-spam
<trwnh> which is part of why twitter became a shithole (there are many reasons but this is the earliest one)
<AlexaPlayDespaci> well in that case
<AlexaPlayDespaci> the Fediverse will only be worse
<trwnh> why do people devote their time to being assholes in replies to famous people? because they know it'll get visibility
<AlexaPlayDespaci> because there's no concept of a thread owner, it's reversed
<trwnh> AlexaPlayDespaci: there's no thread owner on twitter either
<AlexaPlayDespaci> true but I don't think you can untag people there
<trwnh> you can untag but it's not encouraged at all. masto web frontend auto-highlights all secondary mentions so that typing will overwrite them. twitter you have to click through some weird dialogs and uncheck all the people you wanna remove
<trwnh> anyway the main thing i'm talking about is that really, the fact that some resource exists somewhere does *not* require you or your software to advertise its existence
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah that makes sense
<trwnh> as i said to dansup when discussing the "disable comments" thing -- yes, people can *technically* create an inreplyto
<trwnh> but why should you be forced to have it visible on your side?
<trwnh> your software is creating the replies collection
<trwnh> so it should get to decide whether it gets published in full, in part, or at all
<AlexaPlayDespaci> proper activitypub c2s would fix that
<trwnh> it's doable with just s2s
<AlexaPlayDespaci> but Mastodon wouldn't even work with c2s due to it not making a replies collection
<trwnh> when you have your AS2 document just don't add whichever property you don't want to be available
<trwnh> and when generating your HTML / frontend, don't include their representations
<AlexaPlayDespaci> that makes sense
<trwnh> there you go, "disabled" comments (really hidden / delisted, if you wanna nitpick)
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok so
<trwnh> to the user, the distinction may not necessarily matter -- in the same way that technically anyone is free to reply to your post on their own website
<AlexaPlayDespaci> alice@pixelfed.example makes pixelfed.example/p/1 with disabled comments
<trwnh> i could reply to an instagram post by hosting a static html document on my webiste
<trwnh> *website
<trwnh> and that doesn't even require me to have an instagram account
<AlexaPlayDespaci> bob@evil.example makes a comment with an inReplyTo of https://pixelfed.example/p/1
<trwnh> in essence: my resource links to your resource and declares it is inreplyto
<trwnh> your resource does not have to do the same
<AlexaPlayDespaci> cindy@chatty.example follows bob but not alice (and is the only user of chatty.example, so they didn't see alice's post)
<trwnh> mute/block doesn't even factor in here, because you can't "block" someone IRL
<AlexaPlayDespaci> what happens when they get bob's post?  what should chatty.example do with it?
<trwnh> presumably cindy's software can resolve the thread, if alice's post is otherwise public
<trwnh> so cindy would be able to see bob reply to alice
<trwnh> if you visit alice's site, you see no replies
<AlexaPlayDespaci> which kinda defeats the purpose, doesn't it?
<trwnh> if you ask alice's site for the AS2 object, there will not be any "replies"
<trwnh> as far as alice is concerned (and for people visiting alice's site), this is all that is needed
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok, I guess
<trwnh> having some technical way to prevent bob from making a reply is nice, but not needed. bob is free to publish whatever they want
<trwnh> in whatever format
<trwnh> what would be *really* nice is if cindy's software was aware that alice's software had disabled replies
<trwnh> then cindy's software can discard bob's reply as invalid
<trwnh> really the technical solution here is OCAPs as you've probably heard about -- you can't reply to alice's post if you don't know how to refer to it
<dansup> oh well, enough gab talk lets federate some pixels
<AlexaPlayDespaci> oh boy
<AlexaPlayDespaci> everyone here knows Ginny, right?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I just reported her for violating the CoC she wanted implemented in Funkwhale, because she definitely violated it
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I wonder what will happen...
<dansup> i tried to warn you
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I didn't even do anything after the warning
<AlexaPlayDespaci> she decided to go after relatively old toots
<AlexaPlayDespaci> anyway, hopefully she gets some karma
<AlexaPlayDespaci> because she blatantly violated it
<trwnh> AlexaPlayDespaci: why would you care about going after someone so much? give it a rest
<AlexaPlayDespaci> because she personally attacked and insulted me?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> otherwise I wouldn't care
<trwnh> if that's true then block her and move on
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I did
<AlexaPlayDespaci> she doesn't care
<trwnh> idk why people like to draw out conflicts
<dansup> preach
<kaniini> https://mastodon.eliotberriot.com/users/eliotberriot/statuses/102421055009209266
<kaniini> wew
<AlexaPlayDespaci> holy wow
<AlexaPlayDespaci> that's just
<AlexaPlayDespaci> filled with lies
<kaniini> idk
<kaniini> the blog post seems pretty on point
<kaniini> i mean, you're 15, or so you say, but you do have a history of manipulative antisocial behaviour
<AlexaPlayDespaci> well
<AlexaPlayDespaci> most of what he said is just wrong
<kaniini> how is it wrong?  his blog post cites examples of your behaviour
<kaniini> your behaviour isn't great
<AlexaPlayDespaci> because it lies about what I did
<kaniini> if you were an adult, i would not be giving you the opportunity to redeem yourself
<kaniini> no it doesn't
<AlexaPlayDespaci> > DashEquals was the person who archived the now down Berries.Space Mastodon instance
<kaniini> you did take ownership of it
<AlexaPlayDespaci> nope, I supported it.
<dansup> did you delete your dashequals account?
<kaniini> you came out speaking in an authoritative tone justifying the actions of archive team
<kaniini> which means *you took ownership of it*
<AlexaPlayDespaci> yep
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I deleted it
<AlexaPlayDespaci> kaniini not worth debating
<kaniini> it is worth discussing if you want to get to the root of why people hate your behaviour
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok, I'll accept that I did, unfortunately, come across as representing AT's actions
<dansup> lmao
<AlexaPlayDespaci> still, the fact that I've clarified multiple times that I did not do the archiving and yet the myth persisted
<AlexaPlayDespaci> c'mon
<trwnh> AlexaPlayDespaci: highly recommend you take that blog post to heart
<kaniini> i would also highly recommend you stop going by dashequals lmfao
<trwnh> the only thing that's wrong is the bit about you doing the archiving
<kaniini> needless to say you've burned that identity
<kaniini> like
<kaniini> i just want to be blunt for a moment
<trwnh> no point in changing names if the behavior stays the same
<kaniini> you managed to basically get all of the key fediverse technical folks annoyed with you
<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah
<kaniini> think about this
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I'm done with that identity
<kaniini> we have basic consensus that you are ANNOYING
<AlexaPlayDespaci> and I have taken the blog post to heart
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I did make mistakes
<trwnh> that's a lot of mistakes
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I am going to respond to it though, because while parts were true, parts were definitely not
<kaniini> this is a group that cannot agree on anything
<kaniini> and if you doubt this
<kaniini> look at how fucking bad the AP spec is
<kaniini> just to satisfy everyone
<trwnh> if you're serious about improving, uh, i'd advise you to publish an apology instead
<trwnh> "what i did was unequivocally wrong, i'm sorry for it, and going forward i do not plan to continue my behavior
<trwnh> and then actually follow through on it
<trwnh> at this point simply saying "i didn't archive berries" is a nitpick
<trwnh> also, learning when to shut up and let things go is a crucial life skill
<dansup> amen
<dansup> veb and lukevers used to prevent me from saying stupid shit, but now they have familys
<dansup> now trwnh and kaniini are like varys and tyrion
<kaniini> yes also
<trwnh> whomst're they
<kaniini> who the fuck
<kaniini> cares about ginny
<dansup> a good queen is only as good as her advisors
<kaniini> god
<dansup> I've known luke for almost 10 years now, we go back to the meshnet days
<dansup> veb is some dude I met on irc the other night
<kaniini> people should stop getting baited by ginny
<trwnh> people should stop sending shit her way
<kaniini> exactly
<trwnh> she legit gets a lot of harassment
<kaniini> trwnh: she does, but she baits a lot of it too
<kaniini> it is typical borderline personality disorder behaviour
<dansup> this channel should not be so negative, there is a lot of positive things going on right now like pixelfed bringing hashtag follows
<trwnh> calling it "bait" is like victim blaming to me, i don't particularly blame people who are so scarred
<kaniini> bait is maybe wrong word
<kaniini> what i am saying is
<kaniini> she is borderline
<trwnh> it's maybe a bit inflammatory and aggressive (bc it is, rightfully so)
<kaniini> the solution is to ignore those people
<kaniini> and not feed into whatever they are doing
<kaniini> then
<kaniini> 1) you are not part of their problem
<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci did try to creep into her matrix dms, who tf does that lmao
<kaniini> 2) they are not annoying you with their borderline
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I was trying to ask her to stop harassing me
<kaniini> bruh
<trwnh> dude...
<AlexaPlayDespaci> as you're supposed to do according to the CoC
<kaniini> sometimes you just have to recognize
<kaniini> that some people have issues
<kaniini> and be the bigger person
<kaniini> and leave it be
<dansup> her personal account is not a part of the CoC, she is just contracted, not a dev
<kaniini> that too
<AlexaPlayDespaci> she represents the project
<trwnh> you can't really maintain a history of unwanted engagement then say you're the one who wants the harassment to stop
<kaniini> like fuck, just leave her alone
<AlexaPlayDespaci> the CoC applies
<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: the sooner you realize that you shouldn't care what other people say about you online, the better
<kaniini> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
<trwnh> what you shouldve done is, idk, not try to message someone?
<kaniini> also ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
<dansup> "focused on the inner me, never on the enemy" - jesus
<dansup> and big sean
<trwnh> wrt people like ginny, like, i get where they're coming from
<dansup> alexa play marvins room by drake
<kaniini> trwnh: ginny is complicated
<kaniini> trwnh: she does have some good points
<trwnh> i know what it's like to be in her position but only a fraction of it
<trwnh> i quit using twitter bc nazis would flood my mentions
<kaniini> trwnh: i used to be friends with her and broke off the friendship because i couldn't deal with it
<dansup> nobody ever mentions me on twitter besides my homies like luke smh
<kaniini> like
<kaniini> i don't have anything against ginny
<dansup> the only political thing I said on twitter was "stamina" after watching the hillary vs trump debates in sept
<trwnh> dansup: man, saying anything political on twitter in 2016 forward is a goddamn minefield
<trwnh> people namesearch and look for people to actively harass
<trwnh> you say the wrong word and a mob descends on you
<dansup> yeah I never used twitter that much, only used it to follow Skream and Benga on Radio 1 back in 2013/2014
<trwnh> a while back drexel university fired a professor for mocking white genocide as a nonsense conspiracy theory, i said i was considering going to drexel for a masters but decided against it
<trwnh> my mentions for the next 2-3 days were terrible
<dansup> when you actually take a step back and look at the political env compared to 20 years ago, its sad how backwards it is.
<trwnh> all kinds of slurs hurled at me, people posting sieg heil gifs, death threats, etc
<trwnh> i can't imagine living like that 24/7
<trwnh> and that's just one incident, i've had others
<dansup> thats insane, I couldn't imagine that back then
<dansup> now things here in Alberta. Canada are a lot like the USA
<dansup> if you believe in climate change, you are a "liberal cuck" and against our oil industry
<dansup> they make fun of our PM in all the local fb groups
<dansup> and somehow they think trump is better, even tho trump enacted tarrifs against us
<trwnh> seeing stuff like this makes me feel terrible (cw: all kinds of shit, the worst of humanity) https://ginnymcqueen.com/abuse/
<dansup> enough ginny talk, this is not a ginny-hate channel
<AlexaPlayDespaci> you're in alberta!
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I knew you were in canada, but I guess I just thought you were in ontario
<dansup> nah, alberta. its the texas of canada
<AlexaPlayDespaci> lol
<AlexaPlayDespaci> sounds like a cool place
<dansup> trwnh: I agree
<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: its not bad, I'm aboriginal and our lands go back thousands of years
<AlexaPlayDespaci> oh really?  that's awesome!
<AlexaPlayDespaci> does canada treat aboriginals well?  The US shamefully does not
<dansup> well my family emigrated from the USA over 100 years ago, I would have been a chief
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah
<AlexaPlayDespaci> what tribe/region?
<dansup> it passes down from the eldest son to the eldest son
<dansup> I'd have to ask my dad, I dont know off the top of my head. A few years ago we found this out, and my grandpa changed his name to what it used to be
<dansup> this is me at a family reunion https://pixelfed.social/p/dansup/34473
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah cool!
<dansup> all my cousin are bi-racial, you probably couldn't tell my brothers and I are related
<dansup> trwnh: collections are pretty much ready
<trwnh> cool
<dansup> I need to test in dark mode
<trwnh> imo dark mode should be marked as temp-deprecated
<trwnh> it's too incomplete and we keep adding new features
<trwnh> we should use css variables for our palette
<dansup> we do
<dansup> but yeah i agree
<dansup> kaniini: why did you mention me lol
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I think at this point
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I'll try to just not care about what others say
<AlexaPlayDespaci> shouldn't bother me
<AlexaPlayDespaci> anyway, thanks for putting up with me
<dansup> np
<trwnh> AlexaPlayDespaci: if you havent seen it already https://emsenn.net/essays/there-and-back-again-a-fediverse-journey/
<kaniini> this is one of the few platforms
<kaniini> where you can learn from your mistakes and reboot
<kaniini> i suggest you do both of these things
<trwnh> that's the last i wanna say about the whole thing bc frankly i'm tired of the convo lol
<AlexaPlayDespaci> trwnh thanks
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I don't think I have many other accounts
<AlexaPlayDespaci> at least not under a linkable name
<AlexaPlayDespaci> anyway
<AlexaPlayDespaci> all I want at this point is foregiveness
<dansup> you need to earn that
<AlexaPlayDespaci> like, I've said and done some stupid shit, I'll admit
<AlexaPlayDespaci> but like, people are still talking about the archiving thing, and that was a while ago
<dansup> the damage you've done to certain playvicious.social users will probably never be repaired, but you can take this moment as wisdom for the future. Once you turn 18/21 you're an adult and your reputation is everything.
<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I've done damage to PV users?
<dansup> well from what I've seen you've said some pretty inappropriate things regarding slavery and the n-word. I am not white and I can see where they are coming from, these people are twice or 3 times your age and have a lot of life experience.
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I see maybe about the n-word
<AlexaPlayDespaci> but about slavery?
<dansup> What the fuck do you actually know about slavery that they can't google themselves?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> Nothing
<dansup> the fact you even bring it up is not a good sign
<AlexaPlayDespaci> which is why when they posted some BS, I countered it
<dansup> what state do you live in
<AlexaPlayDespaci> why?
<dansup> is it a red or blue state
<AlexaPlayDespaci> blue
<AlexaPlayDespaci> but on the edge
<dansup> are your parents blue or red voters?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> blue
<AlexaPlayDespaci> the county I'm in is very liberal
<dansup> dont lie to me son
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I'm not
<dansup> i dont care, im just asking in the context of this conversation
<dansup> if they are democratic, and you live in a democratic state, why do people think you are alt-right/nazi
<AlexaPlayDespaci> uh IRL, they don't really
<AlexaPlayDespaci> people who actually know me don't think I'm alt-right
<dansup> you play any sports?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> nope
<dansup> you should consider one, great learning experience
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I used to do field hockey
<AlexaPlayDespaci> and before that, wrestling
<dansup> baseball/hockey runs in my blood, and I grew up watching my dad play.
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah cool
<dansup> played em in HS and that is what saved me from bad grades
<AlexaPlayDespaci> both my dad and granddad on his side were wrestlers (not super competitive, just for fun)
<dansup> consider getting into that, you'll make a lot of friends and chicks love that shit
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I wish I could
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I just don't enjoy them, no matter how hard I try
<dansup> you need to find a good coach, maybe your dad
<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah, I guess
<dansup> AlexaPlayDespaci: do it broski, get that scholarship &#128175;
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I really don't think I'd be that good
<AlexaPlayDespaci> you know in gym class how they say "if you do your best you'll get a good grade"?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I did my best and I got a terrible grade
<dansup> thats not an excuse, you need to want to succeed. You can't accept failure without trying your best
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ok true
<AlexaPlayDespaci> sports just like
<dansup> I know you can do it, at least give it a try. I wish I didn't throw away my education, you need to keep all options available
<AlexaPlayDespaci> really are not my thing
<dansup> Did you ever play them much as a kid?
<AlexaPlayDespaci> well yeah
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I quit around age 10
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I am gonna go for more education though
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I like the idea of a merit-based scholarship that's only based on SAT scores
<dansup> yeah do what you want. I can't believe I just said that shit, thats basically what my dad said to me. Sorry a bit drunk
<dansup> im just waiting for webpack to finish compiling
<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah, I should probably listen to you, I'm not that smart about life anyways (more of a computers guy)
<trwnh> being blue in a blue state doesn't really have much bearing on not being lowkey racist, i've found. it's just deep in the culture of america at this point, for a lot of people it's not even intentional, they're just ignorant and out of their element
<trwnh> but if i had a dime for every time someone was in my mentions with that kinda ignorance i'd be rich
<trwnh> it takes active work and effort at being better and improving
<dansup> ^
<kaniini> trwnh: which ignorance
<kaniini> im too lazy to read the log
<trwnh> just microaggressions basically
<trwnh> democrats usually take their being marginally better than republicans as something they should be congratulated over
<AlexaPlayDespaci> ah
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I mean, I'm not a huge dem fan either
<AlexaPlayDespaci> but I don't see the microaggressions there
<trwnh> well yeah the point of microaggressions is that they're these little things that marginalized people just end up living with, except they add up over time
<AlexaPlayDespaci> yeah, I guess it's hard to notice if you're not marginalized
<AlexaPlayDespaci> what was one of the ones that I used?  I would like to avoid using them.
<trwnh> "oh you're so eloquent" said to a black person is a microaggression bc, while on the surface it doesn't seem like a bad thing to say, it subtly calls back to the stereotype that black people are uneducated and AAVE is just bad grammar
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I know what microaggressions are, I was asking for an example since you said that the conversation had them
<trwnh> or "your english is very good" to people who aren't 1st-gen immigrants
<AlexaPlayDespaci> (or maybe I misunderstood you)
<trwnh> stuff like that tends to add up
<trwnh> "you're one of the good ones!"
<trwnh> or like, terrorist jokes
<trwnh> or being expected to denounce every single instance of violence in the middle east
<trwnh> from personal experience
<trwnh> there's the open racism of the right, then there's the subtle racism of the center-right
<trwnh> (bc let's be real, the US does not have a real left wing)
<AlexaPlayDespaci> that's true
<AlexaPlayDespaci> I'm gonna go to bed, you gave me some stuff to think about though

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